Suicide rates are rising. Why isn’t anyone talking about it?

Transcript

Chantelle Ellem 00:21

Welcome to Season One of Feros talks Unsaid, Untold. I’m Chantelle Ellem, also known as Fat Mum Slim. In collaboration with aged care and disability service provider, Feros care. We’re here to tell the stories no one else tells, give space to the people who haven’t previously been heard. Sometimes, it’s uncomfortable, and sometimes it’s even controversial, but it’s always passionate, interesting and ready to unravel a fresh conversation, shifting the way we see diversity and inclusion in Australia.

On today’s episode of Unsaid, Untold, we’re talking about suicide, and it’s something more people should be talking about. In the past year, we’ve seen a rise in suicide across Australia. As, of March 2023. Victoria has seen a 9% increase and New South Wales have seen a 5% increase. According to mental health workers, the trend is occurring nationally. Suicide Prevention Australia’s latest quarterly data has shown 46% of Australians have reported an elevated distress level from cost of living pressures. When Australians were asked to compare their stress levels to this time last year, 74% said, it had risen. That’s some pretty scary numbers. And with so much to worry about housing pressures, mortgage stress, job security, experts are worried, suicide could further increase in the next 12 months.

Lifeline statistics from 2022 report that 8.6 Australians already die every day due to suicide, and a further 65,000 Australians attempt suicide every year. However, outside of, Are you okay day and World Suicide Prevention Day, very few people are having meaningful conversations about suicide and mental health. As far as we’ve come in recent years, there is still a stigma attached to mental health issues and a lack of understanding about suicide. Today I’m sitting down with Kaley from Feros care. Last year, Kaley wrote an article about her personal experience with suicide for the Feros Care website in recognition of World Suicide Prevention Day. And it went viral, having been picked up by multiple media organizations with 1000s of reads and shares. Kaley, thanks so much for joining us. Can you tell us a bit about the personal experience that prompted that article?

Kaley 02:45

Yes, thanks for having me. Absolutely. So, I guess, we’re in a bit of a team meeting last year, and we’re talking about the importance of sharing information about suicide, and obviously, personal stories, because we’re here, I guess, maybe just on our social channels, and those types of things around suicide, or you hear, you know, Are you okay day, World Suicide day information, but you actually don’t hear, I guess, the true everyday stories and how that actually impacts individuals.

So, my story starts many years ago, so about 15 years ago, my father unfortunately passed away from suicide. At the time, I was living overseas, I was a 20 year old, trying to live my best life in London, as most young 20 year olds do, they try and get that world experience. It was about two o’clock in the morning, and my grandma called me and had indicated that my father had passed away from suicide. And I think, the shock of it really kind of forces you into, I guess, action mode. So, for me, if anyone that doesn’t know me, I’m very much, okay, I need to write a list, I need to tick things off and get things done.

So, my first thought was, okay, I now need to pack up my whole life here in London, and move home so, I could be there for my family. So, that’s, you know, packing up all of your belongings that you’ve kind of collected over the last 12 months, whilst living in another country, you know, going in and quitting your job like, I had to do all of this within 24 hours, quit my job, liaised with my family back here in Australia in terms of trying to organize flights to get back home. What was the quickest route, working out, where I was going to live, when I came back home. I guess a lot of different things that you need to do that you don’t really think about. But then, you also can’t process.

I guess the magnitude of the information that’s just been shared with you. Obviously, your father has passed away. You’re never actually going to see him again. It was very much a process I need to do this and this. And it wasn’t until I actually got home and it was probably some months after that. I guess, the shock of it really sank in. I didn’t go through, you know the seven steps of grieving, the seven five steps of grieving.

Chantelle Ellem 05:02

A lot.

Kaley 05:03

Until like many months afterwards because it was all around. Okay, so what do we need to do? Where’s dad’s body? We need to organize a funeral service at that time, and I’m sure a lot of people might be in this situation. We had a family. My family, my parents separated when I was younger, my partner had a new partner. She didn’t get along too well with my dad’s family, so his sisters and his mother. So, I felt a really incredible pressure to try and bring those families together. Obviously, my mum, I needed her support, obviously, through the funeral and those types of things, who was also kind of estranged from my dad’s side of the family.

Obviously, when they broke up, we’ve got at that time, kind of like my stepmother. She didn’t have strong relationships with my father’s side, either. So, I kind of felt this role, this incredible pressure being 21, like a 20 year old, it was a week and a half before my 21st birthday.

Chantelle Ellem 06:03

That’s a lot at that age.

Kaley 06:04

That’s exactly right, to try and bring these families together, at least so that we could give my father the send off that he deserved. I remember going through his funeral, and I probably shed one or two tears, like I gave a eulogy on his behalf in regards to all of the beautiful memories that I had of him because suicide is such an interesting topic. No one ever really wants to talk about suicide. And so for me, it was really important to kind of take away, I guess, this is how he ended his life.

But what an incredible life he led beforehand, like he was an amazing artist, he was an electrician, he was creative, he loved getting outside, he loves surfing, he loved fishing. And all of those types of things is. In his younger years, he was very active. So, soccer, swimming, all of those types of things. So, for me, it was really important to actually add, share, or remind our family and friends of who he was at that point in time. But there were a lot of things. And we’ll probably get to that a little bit later on in the Podcast, that were probably the cause, or not necessarily the cause of your suicide, but probably had a big impact on him, which potentially made him, I guess, decide to end his life because he felt kind of isolated, and he was struggling internally. And a lot of us didn’t do, what we could have to help him through that time.

Chantelle Ellem 07:31

Simply because you didn’t know. Did you like it’s so hard to know what someone’s going through?

Kaley 07:36

That’s exactly right. Like, I think obviously, as a kid growing up and on reflection, now I’m much older, I’ve got a lot more experience in life. But I think, as a kid, like you see, obviously, when my parents separated, I guess the challenges that people go through. And that would be very much in today’s younger age groups as well and older, when people lose a partner, relationships break down and those types of things. I think people do have suicidal thoughts. Because they’ve lost that person. They’ve lost somebody that makes them feel really happy. So, I saw that.

But my dad also actually was in a pretty bad fire and electrical fire from work. And I think, he had a lot of post-traumatic stress following that. So, he was in hospital for several months, skin grafts and those types of things. He would be the person that would go out and people would look at him because he looks different, because he’s wearing his skin graft bandages and those types of things. Obviously, that was for a period of time as you get older, you can remove the bandages and that sort of stuff. And you still need to be really cautious when you’re out in the sun and those types of things. So, your scars don’t get re-burn.

Chantelle Ellem 08:46

That would have an ongoing effect with him.

Kaley 08:48

That’s exactly right. But also I think for him, mentally, he didn’t deal with, I guess the stress and the impact that had on him at that point in time. So, that was probably six months post my parents separating as well. So, he’s kind of had all of these really challenging things happen in a short period of time. And then, it’s just expected to you know, move on. That’s exactly right. And 15 years ago, it was very uncommon for men to go and talk about their feelings or what they’re going through.

Chantelle Ellem 09:20

Yes, it’s such a challenge, isn’t it? But I just dealt with it internally.

Kaley 09:24

And it’s the same in the Defense Force. Like, I think you go to battle, and then, you know, they say, Oh, yes, you’ve got those supports, but you come home and you’re like, oh, no, I’m too much. Oh, I’m too me and to actually talk about what I’ve seen, what I’ve experienced, what I’ve felt. And I think, that very much was probably one of the causes and I’m not going to say, it’s the only cause, there’s probably other factors. But definitely think that played a significant role in the decision later on. I know he struggled with it, the anniversary of the fire and all of that sort of stuff. He would have [Unintelligible 00:09:57] Yes, he would find that very challenging for him.

Chantelle Ellem 10:01

I think, that’s challenging for you too without him leaving a letter, there’s you are having to play this guessing game, I guess of what led to this, how did this happen? And I guess, in a sense, like, what could I have done? So, at least trying to figure that out, isn’t it? It’s a lot of, that’s what.

Kaley 10:17

Yes. So, it’s really interesting because he actually did send me an E-mail the morning, he passed away. But it wasn’t a letter in a sense that he was, you know, I’m about to end my life. It’s like, I’ll speak to you soon. And it was a happy letter. He was telling me what he did over the weekend. I had returned from Egypt, I spent Christmas in Egypt and Jordan. With some of my friends came back, we were just settling in, I’d kind of put off calling him. So, again, you get that guilt. You’re like, I wish I would have called him because maybe that conversation could have changed something.

Chantelle Ellem 10:53

So many what, ifs.

Kaley 10:54

That’s exactly right. But then you can’t sit in that forever, because it’s not good for your mental health. So, you actually need to go, Okay, that is a what if, I can’t control what ifs. I can control what I do here and now and what I can do moving forward.

Chantelle Ellem 11:11

And that’s part of your healing, isn’t it post losing your dad.

Kaley 11:15

Yes, like it took me a very long time to get to that point, though. I think, obviously, I went through my own personal breakups and those types of things. And you get into that kind of like gloom, and that depressive state, but we’re able to pull ourselves out of it.

Chantelle Ellem 11:31

And hopefully be supported through it

Kaley 11:32

Exactly. Right. And often, the most happy people are the ones that probably struggle the most inside. Whereas for Dad, as I said, he sent me that really positive message in the morning. And so I just assumed, you know, he’s doing okay, you know, kick on, it’s pouring with rain outside in London off, I go to work harder. And then, the next day, but it’s really interesting, in a sense that when I got to work, people ask you, how it happened? And I wasn’t prepared for that answer. So, I actually said, he was hit by a car, or a car accident. And in hindsight, I wish I would have, you know, had the confidence to be able to say, actually, it was suicide, and it’s a shame that I wasn’t able to have that conversation with him beforehand.

Chantelle Ellem 12:21

I found that really interesting and heartbreaking at the same time, but there is that stigma attached to it. And there’s so much more, it seems so fine. Or if you can say, he passed away in a car accident, it’s kind of like, Oh, I’m so sorry. Let’s leave it. But if it opens up the conversation otherwise, and maybe you weren’t ready for that. But, I think it’s beautiful that you continuing the conversation now and opening it up so slightly, maybe it couldn’t happen back then, it wasn’t the right time. But now, he is, which is why we’re here. And that’s really great.

Kaley 12:45

Yes, so I think, back then, you know, it would have been probably 12 hours since the phone call, to be asked that question and not actually, one be prepared to process that myself, let alone actually, then share that information with obviously, colleagues, they were, you know, temporary colleagues, or colleagues that I’ve got now, in a sense that you know, only been there a few months. I’d been in London for a year, but I’d been in that particular job for a few months. So, that felt very personal to be to share that information with them.

Chantelle Ellem 13:19

Yes. Especially in that state of mind too [Crosstalk 00:13:22] in shock.

Kaley 13:24

Yeah. And if you think about it, Are you okay, day only started in 2009. So, that’s probably the, I guess, the leading kind of organization that’s really talking about suicide and mental health conversation. That’s the things that was two years after my father passed away. So, again, that stigma at that point in time…

Chantelle Ellem 13:44

Was completely different to where we are today.

Kaley 13:47

Correct. So, it is a very different time. And I’d like to think, look, if Dad have been able to get through that period of time, maybe, he would be able to see all of the great positive conversations that we are having about this now. And that might have changed, or he could have become an ambassador himself or those types of things. But look, again, it’s that only conversation.

Chantelle Ellem 14:08

Which, sadly, we can’t change anything, but it’s nice that in his legacy, you are making such a change. And, you know, your article resonated with so many people last year, because it’s so topical, and it is happening to so many people around Australia, in the world.

Kaley 14:24

It’s funny, I had a lot of actually close friends reach out to me and say, they obviously knew my father had passed away, but we’ve probably come closer friends and like the last, you know, five or four years, so they don’t really know the details, when they’re actually like, oh, this person close to me had those kind of similar suicidal thoughts and have been hospitalized or I’ve also lost somebody from suicide. So, it’s actually then kind of became a bit of a support for them as well to know, that they’ve got somebody else that they can talk to about that.

But I think, from a suicide perspective, we need to have the conversation beforehand. And I think, that conversation needs to be around depression and it needs to be around anxiety. And it needs to be around the pressures that we have in our day to day life. Because it’s those things that actually get you to suicide. So, how can we normalize the conversation around depression? How do we normalize the conversation around mental health? How do we normalize the conversation around anxiety because anxiety can actually lead to depression, which then can lead to…

Chantelle Ellem 15:29

Yes, it’s also connected.

Kaley 15:30

That’s exactly right. And I think, if we look at how we live today, it is so much more complex than what it was 15 years ago, to 30 years ago.

Chantelle Ellem 15:41

The pressures are so different, and it’s so challenging. That’s what I think. Are you okay, day has played a big part in us opening up the conversation, but it still feels like, it’s almost not enough. Like, it seems like it gets to a point like, are you okay? And if someone says, No, I’m not. It’s like, where do we go from there? Because no one knows what to do. And I think, that’s something that we could change, hopefully, that we get more mindful about, like, and what does checking in with people and what do people need? I think, that’s such a big part of moving forward and having a greater conversation about not being okay.

Kaley 16:13

Yes. So, are you okay day is, you know, one day, one week, and one month, we’ve got 52 weeks of the year, we’ve got 12 months, we really need to have that conversation more often. And World Suicide Prevention Day is around that same time.

Chantelle Ellem 16:31

You get this burst, that hearing and minutes, like, oh, everyone’s okay, the rest of the year.

Kaley 16:35

That’s exactly right. And look, I think we need to go more than you know, just posting on our walls. [Crosstalk 00:16:40] It does feel very tokenistic. As opposed to actually genuinely sitting down and having a conversation with your friends and your loved ones, you know, when your friends and loved ones are feeling a little bit blue, or are behaving a little bit differently. That’s when you need to have those conversations. But the end, the conversation doesn’t necessarily need to be.

Chantelle Ellem 17:03

You don’t have to be a therapist.

Kaley 17:04

That’s exactly what you need to be there as a friend, or a loved one, you actually also need to show that you care, put your phone down, like stop scrolling on Instagram and Facebook and actually invest time in somebody that might be struggling and actually show you care and show you support. Take them somewhere, get them out of that, I guess potential spiral or element that they might be in, even if they are confining themselves to a bedroom, take them to the lounge room. Get them to sit outside on the back porch and you know, have a cup of tea and fresh air.

Chantelle Ellem 17:38

I think, reminding them that it can be a passing moment. Like, always think just one more day, let’s just hang in there one more day. As a teen, I went through some stuff. And I remember being in my early 20s. And just thinking I cannot do this anymore. And I just was like, I was so scared. I didn’t know, what I was going to do. I just wanted it all to end and I ended up calling my dad, I just felt so alone. I just said, “Dad, I’m really scared.” I think, I’m going to do something to myself. And he came up and it just was like that. He stopped everything, left work, came and drove three hours to be with me. And it just was like, he just said, I’m here with you for as long as I need to be. And I think, that’s what that is. And even at this old age, being there for people. But checking in the next day. I think, it’s not just knowing that you’re there for a long time and I checking in every day and just having a presence and showing them that I’m here for you like, whenever you need, I’ll be here for you. It’s hang in there.

Kaley 18:31

And it’s that you touched on it. I’m so alone, you might have 1000 friends, you have 1000 people around you. But in that point in time, when you feel, I guess that vulnerable in that situation. You need that one person that is going to sit there, they can let you cry. They can let you talk. They can do anything to support you. But it is you need to get through that one day, that one hour. Like, you know what I mean?

Like, I think even if I can’t get through the day, okay, let’s break it down. How do you break it down? Let’s get to the next minute. Let’s get to the next hour. Let’s get through all of the things but also talk about it. We often feel [Crosstalk 00:19:11] isn’t it? We often feel like it’s okay, if we change the subject. Oh, well, you know, the sky is blue. The birds are singing like everything’s fine. I’m like no. Why do you feel like this? What can we do to make you not feel like this? There are things that we can control and there’s things that we can’t control. So, how can we what are the things that we can control that might make you feel a little bit better?

Chantelle Ellem 19:38

Because it feels so massive and big and I don’t want to be part of it but as that person in it and it’s like well, if you don’t want to talk about it, I’ll sit here until you do like not as a pressure thing but I’m here, if you want, when you want to talk about it, we can talk about nothing or we can skirt around the issue till you want to go and talk about it but that is like, it’s a hard role being a support person first you’re lifeline to that person. It’s such an important role

Kaley 20:02

Mentally and emotionally draining to be that person for somebody else. But you wouldn’t have it any other way, in that point and time. You would do anything for the person you care about. In this world, you also see people do anything for people, that they don’t even know, the kindness of strangers, you see people, you know, standing on bridges, and doing things and it’s that one other person that can potentially build a connection with them to make them feel valued, and cared about and important.

Chantelle Ellem 20:34

And to be seen, I think they need to be…

Kaley 20:35

Should be seen.

Chantelle Ellem 20:36

Yes, because in this world, where they feel like I’m not important to be seen, those after stories of people that have survived those situations, it’s like, that role, that person that helped them has played, is so integral and so important.

Kaley 20:51

And I think, people when they’re in that, I guess, mindset, they also feel like they’re being a burden on other people as well. That’s why, they often don’t share how they’re feeling. Not only because they don’t want to be judged, it was definitely something that I experienced, I imagined my dad experienced at that point in time. They don’t want to be judged for you know, having this moment of vulnerability and crises at that point in time.

Because they might be that person, that has everything together, you know, the perfect life, the perfect family, and things are probably falling away, behind the scenes. They don’t want to be a burden on somebody, they don’t want to be a burden on society. So, in their mind, life is easier without them. In reality that’s absolutely not the truth. They don’t know, they’re that somebody else’s person that they can hug at night and feel safe. Yes.

Chantelle Ellem 21:44

They have important role they play in lives. We want you to hang around because it’s so important.

Kaley 21:50

Every life like is really funny. So, my mum’s re-married. And my stepdad is from the US. And he used to recruit students to go on for higher education. And I remember sitting in one of his presentations, and he said, we’re all fighters. And we all kind of a city. We’re like, what the hell are you talking about, he is talking about semen, he is talking about sperm, because we were [Unintelligible 00:22:16] that fought to get there. So, we came into this world, we were fighters. So, I always like to think, you know, in life, like if we fought that hard before we were even born like, we can still do that now. As individuals day in and day out.

Chantelle Ellem 22:36

Yes, it is a battle. We do have to fight.

Kaley 22:38

Sorry for that. But [Crosstalk 00:22:40] you got to fight for this, if you want, you know.

Chantelle Ellem 22:44

And beyond this hurdle, there is beauty like there is the good stuff, just on the other side, we just have to get through it.

Kaley 22:50

Yes. And that’s the thing, like getting through it is the hardest part. Like, it might be that first initial, you know, I feel like this, but then, you actually have to take the steps to get through it. But then, I used to hate the same. Time heals all things. I’d be like, stop preaching that to me, you know, I’m going to [Crosstalk 00:23:11] God, dad, but now like, you know, when you come over certain challenges, you’re also like, you know what it does? That you don’t at that point and time, and for a period of time afterwards. It’s really bloody hard.

Chantelle Ellem 23:25

Yes. And time does make it a little bit easier too. I’ve seen that thing on grief, where it’s like, the size of grief doesn’t change, but everything around it gets bigger. So, it’s like you still carry that grief with you everywhere. But now, you’ve got a daughter and that makes all that stuff outside of grief bigger.

Kaley 23:43

It does. And it’s like, I can’t imagine a world without her. And she obviously can’t imagine a world without me.

Chantelle Ellem 23:50

And how do you like to remember your dad? What part does he play in your life now, that obviously she didn’t get to meet him, but I’m sure that you make sure that he’s a part of your life.

Kaley 24:00

She is so like him. She is tall. She has these little curls in the back of her hair, exactly like him. The biggest blue eyes, you’ve ever seen. I’ve got blue eyes, but I feel like her as a bluer. And she just looks very similar to him. And it’s just cheeky, like my dad was really cheeky. He had this like wicked sense of humor, alternate wicked sense of humor. So, not everybody would get here, it is not everyone’s cup of tea. But if you do get him, you would really appreciate him and my daughter is exactly like that.

But when she was born, obviously, before I announced the name, I had my private chat with him like Hey, Dad, what do you think of this name? And it goes really well with our last name. You know, Farrington, I’m carrying on that name. My daughter’s name is Ashley rose, by the way, and thank you. But then, after I came out of hospitals, so I was in there five days. I’m quite an active person. And where we laid my father’s ashes is just around the corner from where I live. So, at Currumbin Estery, on the Gold Coast, and so I walked out there to our special spot, you know, sat down and took a photo with my pram, my baby, which is, you know, really small, spending some time like getting to meet grandpa for the first time, which is really nice.

And we’ve got a lot of my dad’s artwork hanging around my house, as well as lots of photos. Although, we don’t have as many photos as what we do now. Like, I think, my camera roll on my phone. Yes, he has like 4000 photos as a small child, try to find photos of you and your dad. Before mobile phones were popular. They had cameras. And it was you know, the old school printed film at Kodak. There’s not as many photos as I’d like. But we do have a few around the house.

Chantelle Ellem 25:56

He is part of the conversation.

Kaley 25:57

That’s right. And I think, it’s important that she knows who he was as well, she obviously might, as I said, my mom’s re-married, has a grandpa. But I still want her to know, the other side of my family as well, it’s really important that she understands her genes. And again, if she has depression, those types of things. I want her to know what our side of the family is, that side of the family is also experienced, it’s really important to have that conversation.

Chantelle Ellem 26:24

And why do you think it’s so important to be such an open book about this topic? Like that’s a big ask of you. And I think, it’s so amazing that you are so willing to talk about it so openly.

Kaley 26:36

Because not enough people do. And if you look, I’m one of 10 million people in Australia who has been impacted by the loss of suicide. So, one in 10 million, and that figure is obviously rising every day. So, I think about nine people die every day of suicide in Australia.

Chantelle Ellem 26:54

Devastating.

Kaley 26:55

It’s a devastating stat. But when you calculate that annually, and then over years, that number is only growing. So, it is important that we have the conversation. And I think, it’s taking it away from how I guess mainstream media might, you know, run their own narrative around it. I think, if you allow everyday people to share their stories, and normalize it, I think as supposed to this happened because I think, still in media if people pass away from suicide overseas. I don’t think they give the individual justice that they need. So, I think it’s important to understand the impact it has on the family members, it has on the friends, it has on the community, has on workforce.

Chantelle Ellem 27:40

And then the conversation open.

Kaley 27:41

That’s exactly right. Because other people might be feeling the same way. And if you can, I guess stop one person from committing suicide? I think we’ve done our job.

Chantelle Ellem 27:52

Yes, that’s right. And you’ve worked with Feros care for quite a few years now. How did they support mental health? And how can other organizations do a better job?

Kaley 28:03

Yes, I think I’m really lucky. So, working with Feros Care for five years, as an organization, we work in the care industry. So, if we didn’t show our empathy and support for people who might be struggling generally, or to how to handle those conversations, so we work in aged care and disability. So, particularly in the aged care space, we need to make sure that our workforce is equipped, I guess, with the skills of dealing with people who are particularly clients or seniors, who might have lost loved ones, because of other illnesses. And they’ve, you know, been married for 50, 60 years, and they’re now facing a life in their final years, potentially different. It’s very different.

And a lot of them, I guess, do have those suicidal thoughts, because it is different. They don’t understand, they’ve got to learn how to cook for themselves. They might have to, you know, take themselves shopping, which they never did before, their wife or husband might have been, you know, the social organizer. So, they’ve then, become more socially isolated, because they don’t know, how to call barrel or moves and those types of things. So, the beautiful thing at Feros care is, we have a mental aid, Mental Health First Aid program that we’ve instilled, and that’s been with us, I think, since 2019, I could be wrong. It could be the last two years. And we’ve had so many of our employees go through that program.

And it’s so important because you can go and have first aid where you can give CPR, you can apply, you know, bandages and those types of things to snake bites. But what we do, when somebody says, I’m actually not doing okay, so I think as an organization, it’s really important that we recognize that and can equip our employees to have those conversations particularly with their clients. But I know that though, those conversations are actually not just stopping with our clients. They’re using that as part of their everyday life.

Chantelle Ellem 29:59

That is making a huge difference.

Kaley 30:00

That’s exactly right. If I could recommend one thing for every organization to invest in it, would be to invest in Mental Health First Aid for your employees. The other beautiful thing at various care is, we have access to EAP. A lot of large organizations, which is our Employee Assistance Program, which gives us access and our immediate loved ones, and access to counselors as needed. So, again, if there is a situation that has happened to the client, personal situation, those types of things, you know, that you can actually call somebody confidentially, the cost of living is really expensive. So, you know, you can call counselors and speak to professionals, without actually dipping into your own pocket.

Chantelle Ellem 30:43

That’s amazing. Because sometimes it can be so hard to get care, and to know that can make such a difference, especially for families to be able to get that as well, it’s really important, such a good thing to be doing. So, dealing with the dead suicide must have been very challenging. How did that affect your own mental health?

Kaley 31:04

It was hard. So, I think, back then, again, I don’t think, I had the mental or emotional maturity at that time to process it properly. I guess, I took a lot of blame on myself. I was you know, his pride and joy, his beautiful daughter. And I felt like, maybe I’d abandon him because I wanted to go and live my life overseas and try new things. And I left him. So, that played a significant, I guess, had an impact on me. And for many years afterwards, probably until my mid to late 20s. I kind of blamed myself in regards to, I probably shouldn’t have left him

Chantelle Ellem 31:49

He sounded so proud in all the communications with you. So, if we look at the reality of it, I mean, there’s no helping how you felt because that’s, you have to honor those feelings. But he obviously was so proud of you, and was so happy with what you were doing.

Kaley 32:04

He was. And that’s the thing, he was super thrilled that I was going out. And I was living my life, I was exploring, I was traveling to different countries, you know, having a taste of different cultures, and you know, really immersing myself in that experience. But I think, in the back of my mind, I always was like, and I left him probably in a really vulnerable state or he had a vulnerable period of time, right before he suicide that I was living my life and didn’t realize that he was struggling so much. So, that really played a big role. A lot of other things happened. Obviously, family breakdowns and those types of things that he was probably dealing with on his own and didn’t share that information with me.

Chantelle Ellem 32:53

Yes, which not all parents would share with their kids. Yes.

Kaley 32:56

But I guess, I just didn’t really grieve, as I said, like, I didn’t grow for a few months afterwards. But then, I still don’t know if I really grew like I’d have moments of, breakdowns and being like, why, what’s going on, those types of things. But I think, as I said, not until my late 20s, when I experienced my own falling a breakup, my own distress and my own pain. And you know, kind of you spiral and you go through those types of things.

Chantelle Ellem 33:24

It’s like I opened up the wound, didn’t they allow you to grieve and feel everything you needed to feel.

Kaley 33:28

That’s exactly right. I felt like everything kind of hit me at once. Like, I was not only like grieving the loss of a relationship, but I was also grieving the loss of my father, grieving things that, you know, happened through your childhood and those types of things. So, I think, it all just hit me at once. But I think, I probably needed that. To be the person I am today, to be the mother I am today, to my daughter, to be the friend, to be the daughter to my parents as well.

Chantelle Ellem 33:56

And what got you through that? Was it a particular friendship that helped you through that harder time? Was it part of your solo process for you? Was there anything in particular that helped you get through that?

Kaley 34:06

It’s very much a solo process, I needed to do it on my own. I needed to know that I had people around me but I didn’t want people to tell me how to feel, tell me what to do. And I think that’s probably a really important thing to raise. You can’t tell somebody how to feel if they’re in a bad state. Like, if somebody has suicidal thoughts. You can’t tell them. Oh, you know, there are people here or you’ve got a beautiful house. You’ve got all of these things [Unintelligible 00:34:38] that’s exactly right. You can’t tell somebody how to feel because you actually don’t know how they feel.

Chantelle Ellem 34:44

And even when people say, it’ll be okay. And it’s like, kind of it was infuriating. Because, I mean, there’s really [Crosstalk 00:34:40] yes. Will it be okay, like, you don’t know, like, I just need to, you know, breathe and get through today. And, know that I’m not alone.

Kaley 34:58

And that’s the thing, you need to be there, you need to be present. But you can’t tell people.

Chantelle Ellem 35:04

It’s so complex isn’t it? It’s such a complex issues.

Kaley 35:07

And you can ask them questions. And if they feel comfortable, they will talk to you, mental health is so complex. And that’s why, I think, the work of counselors, psychiatrists, our health professionals as well, like nurses deal with this and day to day basis, our doctors say, this regular too, like, no solution is going to fit everyone like you. It all has to be tailored, it has to be specific to the person on the other ends needs.

Chantelle Ellem 35:43

And I think we’ve got so much work to do. But I think this is part of the work that we’re doing, which is having conversations and being open and talking about and I think that is key to moving forward and hopefully, changing people’s lives and helping them get through the challenging times.

Kaley 35:59

Yes, like, I would be happy to talk to anyone, obviously, with my personal experience, but obviously somebody is in a challenging situation, whether your friend, family, or a complete stranger. Having been what I’ve been through, hopefully, I can share my insights to support others, then again made a conversation. People know how to reach me.

Chantelle Ellem 36:22

That’s so beautiful. And people knowing that they’re not alone.

Kaley 36:26

That’s right.

Chantelle Ellem 36:27

The numbers show people aren’t alone. There’s so many going through this every single day.

Kaley 36:31

You might feel alone, but you’re not alone.

Chantelle Ellem 36:35

Yes, beautiful. Thank you so much for sharing and being so open today. It was so beautiful to hear your story. And I’m so sad and sorry that your dad’s no longer with us. But I just think, it’s so beautiful, the legacy that you are carrying and opening the conversation and being an important part of moving forward.

Kaley 36:50

Thank you very much. Thanks for letting me share my story.

Chantelle Ellem 36:53

Thanks for being here.

Thank you for listening to this episode. And thank you to not only Kaley but everyone else who has spoken up about mental health. It’s not an easy topic. As mentioned on this Podcast, there are many resources and tools out there such as lifeline, the Suicide Callback Service, Beyond Blue and Standby support after suicide. You can also find out more about Mental Health First Aid training via MHFA.com.au. If this episode is brought up anything for you, support is always available from Beyond Blue on 13-22-46-36 and Lifeline on 13-11-14. Take care of yourselves and speak to you next time on Unsaid, Untold.

Disclaimer: The content and views discussed in Feros Talks podcast episode are those of the individuals involved. They are not necessarily condoned by, or, are the views of Feros Care or its employees.